What is the ae-team's attitude and measures for the mining pool?


#1

How to prevent the emergence of super mine pool?


Any suggestion how to build a mining pool for AE mining?
#2

Hello,

Here is the answer from our dev team: Cuckoo Cycle is very unfriendly algo for open pools. There are no partial, self-describing solutions that may be a base for payment to pool participants.

Regards,
Vlad


#3

More decentralization


#4

Is that means the massive GPU farm will not be profitable in AE mining?
And does all miner have to mining on their own, and you just can mining a block or not, not contributing together with other miners to get one block?
Does that means the mining is more on one’s luck.


#5
  1. no, quite opposite, massive GPU farm will be profitable, but it will work best if it is trusted farm

  2. with Bitcoin-NG consensus we will use PoW to determine a temporary (one generation, ~2-3 minutes) leader. The leader will confirm all incoming transaction. Another miners don’t contribute during that phase. They try to be the leader for next generation.

  3. No, mining is correlated mostly with miners’ memory (hence large setups of GPUs have biggest chance to mine a block)


#6

@ae-vlad hello, vlad, there different opinions, which is right ? And is there has logo tag for ae-team’s forum members ?


#7

Hi, I am from aeternity team. I need to sort out the avatar.

There are not precise opinions, but not contradictory :wink:

Cuckoo is not friendly to open pools. It is fine, tho, to create private pool (the one where you trust workers to do their job)

Why cuckoo is not friendly? It is two step PoW:

  1. find solution to a graph (~1sec effort)
  2. hash it to check if it is below the target ( -> 0 sec)

We didn’t contribute much effort to research how to proof that workers indeed do their work. If someone finds less difficult hash it still doesn’t represent underlying work on graph. So, this is something to figure out for public pools.


#8

Thanks your ansewer, michalzee


#9

Cuckoo is not friendly to open pools.

do you mean the open pools like suprnova is not friendly? i don’t want to have the solo mining, as we are using these open pools, what could happen to us ?


#10
  1. Shame, what I thought would be true decentralization was what attracted me to Aeternity. Sounds like AE mining will just as concentrated as any other crypto.
  2. Which kind of memory, RAM or GDDR???

#11

it is really hard to answer this question as PoW implementations change rapidly.

Over last couple months cuckoo become ASIC friendly.

Also, it is possible to configure it with open pools.

I recommend to look at Cuckoo resources. We intend to use it directly, so we inherit the characteristic of it.


#12

If someone finds less difficult hash it still doesn’t represent underlying work on graph.

Can you explain more your message here. I probably am missing something here.

There are pools using cuckoo algo right now so it is doable. What those pool does is it just verifies if the graph solution is valid then checks if the difficulty is below target. If you check the difficulty target then you can get how much work is being done by the miner already.


#13

I meant following: The hash is less self-describing than in the case of, say, Bitcoin.

As you correctly pointed out there are two runs. First find a graph and then be below the target.This is why we need those two checks. Also mind that finding the graph is heavier operation than hashing for target.

Simply, reward model and risk/gain model is a bit more complex. It’s because a pool worker that gets correct hash after multiple graph solutions (heavy*X) is rewarded the same as worker who gets correct hash for the first time. So, they spend significantly different amount of computation = electricity and get the same reward.

Of course, it evens out in a long run especially with powerful pool equipment.